By GottaLaff
Last night I posted breaking news on all things torture. Today I have a little more information that may help to clarify some of the earlier details. Today's L.A. Times had two articles, one on Dennis Blair's statements, and one on the military's role in torturing terrorist suspects. First, a short update about Blair's remarks. Here's the money quote:
"The information gained from these techniques was valuable in some instances, but there is no way of knowing whether the same information could have been obtained through other means," the statement said.Let's be clear: Whether or not some detainee gave up some information is irrelevant to the argument that torture is illegal. Holding a gun to someone's head is an effective way to avenge the murder of a family member, but you'd probably get thrown in jail for doing that.
Next, a few more details that may help to explain the training methods for troops and how they found their way into the legal memos:
A U.S. military agency that trains troops to resist and survive torture offered crucial help in developing harsh interrogation techniques used by the CIA, according to a Senate report to be released today.Today on the Stephanie Miller Show, a caller who had been trained at a SERE school in San Diego called in with an interesting tidbit. He said that yes, he had been tortured as part of the training program. However, he was assured, repeatedly, throughout the process, that he would not die. He was given a certain "comfort level" because he knew he'd come out of it okay, an advantage not offered to prisoners who were waterboarded (or otherwise tortured).
The military expertise also was used by the Justice Department to develop controversial legal justifications for abusive interrogation methods, the report by the Senate Armed Services Committee said. [...]
Most of the methods were used at the military's Survive, Evade, Resist and Escape -- or SERE -- schools to prepare American service members for possible torture in captivity overseas. [...]
The report shows that military and intelligence officials started planning harsh techniques as early as February 2002, seven months before the tactics were approved by the Justice Department. [...]
In a memo uncovered by Senate investigators, Joseph Witsch, an instructor with the personnel recovery agency, wrote that interrogation methods in use at the time were "far too limited in scope" to be useful on suspected Al Qaeda terrorists.
"We must have a process that goes beyond the old paradigm of military interrogation for tactical information or criminal investigation for legal proceedings," Witsch wrote. [...]
Levin said top civilians in the Bush administration allowed the SERE program to be used to mistreat detainees. [...]
The report notes that a week after the personnel recovery agency described the techniques to Defense Department lawyers, former Assistant Atty. Gen. Jay S. Bybee issued a memo allowing the CIA to use 10 of the SERE techniques against Abu Zubaydah, who was believed to have been a high-ranking Al Qaeda operative.
The Senate report found that at the SERE schools, safeguards were used when demonstrating torture techniques on American service members. However, many of the safeguards were left out when the methods were taught to CIA interrogators. [...]
The report said some military officials forcefully warned against using the SERE techniques on detainees. Some warned that use of the tactics would be illegal. Others emphasized that they would be counterproductive. [...]
"This will increase the amount of information they will tell the interrogator," Banks wrote, "but it does not mean the information is accurate."
So anyone who tosses out, "Hey, our guys went through it, so it's okay" can lock that argument away for good.
One more thing: BushCo tortured people over and over and over again to get them to say that Iraq and Al Qaeda were working together. Thus, the political cover needed to justify Bush's fraudulent war in Iraq.
To be continued...
UPDATE, via Fernando:
1) The Library Tower plot was disrupted in 2002 with the help of foreign intelligence.
2) KSM was captured and waterboarded in 2003 - the source of Blaire's stupid rant.
Latest from Fernando: that plot was foiled in 2002. But Sheikh Mohammed wasn't captured until March 2003. - Slate
.jpg)